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confusion

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Relationship problems and advice
« on: June 02, 2017, 01:24:47 am »
Hi all,

Apologies if this is the wrong place to put the thread.

I have some advice I need to get from people who don't know my fiance and I personally.. Mostly because of bias among the people around us and I just don't know who to believe anymore..

I'm also hoping to see if any fellow wives/steady girlfriends/men(?) have this problem and if we can perhaps provide support for each other if you're in the same situation as me.

My fiance and I have been dating for about 5 years. We are both working and are planning to get married. We have actually already paid for many of our wedding things by now. The date is end of this year..

Truth is, ever since he started his post grad studies about coming to 2 yrs ago, we have been having many problems. They center around not spending quality time together. Due to the nature of his post grad, after the first 3 years, he will be even more busy when he graduates and he will also be required to serve a bond. He has expressed deep interest in staying with the company he is at for the next 8 years at least. He has also hinted that he probably wishes to work with them for the rest of his life and has no plans to move to a different one. His career prospects are quite good and he should be able to promote steadily over the next 8 years as the director really likes him.

As he is working and studying at the same time, he is constantly with his school/work mates. As a result, he became really close to one of them. A guy though... the man is ~ 5 years older, married with young children. Does not have a good relationship with his wife (she has problems with him not spending time with the family and they fight a lot). His working hours are incredibly long and erratic. Most days, he leaves about 6:50am - 7:15am and he finishes at about 8 - 9pm. About 3 times a week (inclu weekend) he ends after 11:30pm or after midnight. In between, I don't hear from him at all.  He is on his whatsapp constantly, but partly for work so he does read my messages, he just doesn't have time to reply them.

We are partially cohabiting due to his crazy post grad lifestyle. He comes over occasionally after work. The only problem is, he did not make any effort to let me know his plans ahead of time even though I've repeatedly expressed for him to text me at about 6 pm (official knock off time exclu OT as above) to let me know if he's coming over. He will typically text me at maybe 9:45pm "I'm reaching soon". Quite often I get the messages at 10:30pm and later. About 1 -2/week I will receive a text at 11:45pm "I'm home. good night".

While I was very happy I get to at least see him (since he works over the weekend as well) during those times, sometimes I get irritated that he does not bother to let me know when he is about to come over (takes about 40 min to 1 hr before he reaches). Couldn't he have informed me at 8.45pm when he had already decided he's coming over? His answer is he's too busy (although he's mostly talking to his "friend" on whatsapp on the way home). Due to his erratic habits, there are many nights where I pointlessly wonder if he is coming over, only to receive a message that he is home late at night.

Lately above friend of his keeps asking him out, talks sexually about other girls consistently and has no sense of "family" time if you ask me. I notice my fiance is talking more and more like him, and their mannerisms are the same. I feel that the friend is bad influence and have sounded out to him many times, but he feels that I'm just jealous and possessive that he is so close to someone else.

He used to have close friends, but never to a point where he goes to work earlier just to have breakfast with him, goes to have lunch with him, and if they are not getting dinner together and are physically apart, have to constantly text each other (even while we are out on a lunch date he does that too). He is not gay I am sure of it.

Anyway, the nights that he gets back late, he has work to do and is not keen on talking to me.. it has reduced to just "hi" and "good night" when I go to bed first (his sleeping hour is hugely dependent on when his friend goes to bed). We are constantly fighting and I find myself feeling jealous that his friend has so much of his time while I don't. Which in turn makes me feel like I'm turning crazy and really behaving possessive.

Moving on, I have taken to texting him daily in the evenings to ask him if he's coming over and what time as he said he doesn't have time to take the initiative to inform me. Now, he usually informs me when he is on the train home, or on a cab so I know he will reach approx 30 - 1hr min time. He said he would be back at 7pm (miracle.), at 6:30pm, I did not hear from him. I waited till 7:10pm to call. I called him to ask him where he was and he got very angry, said I was checking on him. He told me yesterday to stop asking him when he is coming over, don't text him, don't call him and even if I do, he will not reply or not answer. He will come over whenever he wants, hang out with whoever he wants and do whatever he wants and he does not need to let me know.

Some people in our lives tell me just let him do whatever he wants and forget about it. Others tell me they check in with their gf/bf at least every 6 hours or so and if they're going to meet them they will let each other know and it's normal to call if there's no news. Many tell me to break up as he lives his life too much like a single and has no signs of wanting to live like a family.

Regardless, I've decided apart from this friend thing, more importantly, should we get married after all? He makes me feel like I'm really controlling. Truthfully I only text him pretty much once a day at ~ 6pm to ask about his evening plans. I no longer expect him to reply to anything, even if it's really important during his working hours. I'm not sure what a "healthy" relationship is supposed to be like. My friend told me she once dated a guy that she only saw for 2 hrs a week but they text each other throughout the week. I don't mind that... except that, he doesn't have time to "chat" with me on texts, only time for his friend.

Will we end up the same as his friend's wife who feels like their children (and her) are neglected? Will our constant fights over the same thing affect the children and us? I have so many doubts.. I hope someone with a busy spouse can offer real adv on how you deal with it because right now, he wants to have kids and expects me to raise the kids on my own (wants no part in going to any doctors, wants them to go for enrichment lessons but doesn't want to bring them etc). I don't know if I'm prepared for such a family life...

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beaverjuice

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2017, 07:45:32 am »
dear confusion,

texting/watsapping is the death of conversations.  the end of conversations is the start of the death spiral of relationships.

the good thing is that you have not reached the stage of indifference to his behavior.  indifference is the death knell and tombstone of relationships.  at least you want to salvage this and make it better.  so there is hope yet. 

having said that, it takes both hands to clap.  impov, you need some serious HTHT with your fiancé.  and he's gotta want a part in this relationship and work towards making it better.  and if he doesn't want to give you time of day to have the "Talk" then you know your place in his priority of things which is at the bottom of the ladder i'm afraid.

lastly,  don't be a door-mat in this relationship.  this is a partnership and not a dictatorship.

don't believe this bullshit about not having time to text you in response
"For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.” - Matthew 6:21

I feel for you and I don't feel very treasured in this relationship

wishing you well,
uncle bj

PS:  piggy does as piggy frens do.   

« Last Edit: June 02, 2017, 08:01:19 am by beaverjuice »
"A man who has depths in his shame meets his destiny and his delicate decisions upon paths which few ever reach."

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confusion

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2017, 08:39:45 am »
Hi Uncle BJ,

heartfelt thanks to your reply. I'm appreciative you bothered to read through my essay..
He doesn't wish for any HTHT as he said he is busy and has a lot of work  to do. Whenever I try to initiate HTHT (eg when I told him I want us to have dinner together and I promise I will leave him to do his own things after that and not bother him if there is nothing extremely urgent - there usually isn't anyway). His response is he has no time, just let him be and eat with my family. Or he starts shouting at me (and everyone else can hear him despite the doors being closed), then threatening he wants to leave.

You have no time to spare me 30 - 45 min a day while you are texting your friend the whole time during dinner? Why... I told him, we don't talk anymore.. I don't know anything about him and he doesn't know anything about me..

What is the point of getting married to a man and feeling like I'm basically alone all the time? He said my expectations are very unrealistic as there is no need to check in with me when he knocks off and why do we need to have dinner together when we are physically together already. It seems like he is more of an unfriendly room mate than a spouse to be... perhaps I'm really unrealistic, I just want to know if he cares about me. I don't ask for much, if he doesn't talk/text to me at all, I wouldn't know if he does hence I want to at least have dinner together. I wait for him to come over when he says he is no matter how hungry I am because I think it is worth it.

If he checks in with me every 4 hours during the day, I don't even need to have dinner with him.

Don't know if I'm getting married to a man who just wants to behave like he is single. Sometimes I feel like he is getting married just because his friends are and he doesn't want to look like he has no one.

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beaverjuice

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2017, 11:00:51 am »
dear confusion,
as I said, I think you've allowed yourself to be a doormat in this relationship.

intuitively, I sense that this has been the case even when you guys just got together as a couple. ie.  you've always listened to him and played your part as a submissive galfren,  thinking that this is your role and place in the relationship. 

so after 5 years in the relationship, you want to take this to a different level or at least expect the relationship to move to a different level of intimacy (and I don't mean hei-sho hei-sho :P) - but it is sadly not the case.

that's because your fiancé is not reading your "love-language" right - he thinks that the norm is a woman should stay at home and wait for her man.  conversation is meaningless unless it is about a transaction. 

go read the 5-levels of communication. I think after 5 years, you guys have only gotten level 1 and 2 and maybe broach level 3.  That is, at a very superficial level of intimacy

https://powertochange.com/sex-love/spark/
http://www.allprodad.com/5-levels-of-communication-your-marriage-needs/
http://touchoffaith.org/family_ministry/communication/five_levels.htm


lastly,  his family - i'm taking a wild guess that the relationship between his dad and mom is somewhat "traditional" ie. man work, woman housewife or their relationship might be somewhat strained or tenuous,  at best they might be indifferent and lead separate lives, at worst they might even be divorced.
(good to understand his familial relationships - it might give you some useful pointers).

wishing you well,
uncle bj
« Last Edit: June 02, 2017, 11:09:58 am by beaverjuice »
"A man who has depths in his shame meets his destiny and his delicate decisions upon paths which few ever reach."


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confusion

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2017, 12:20:35 pm »
Hi uncle bj,

Your article was very helpful, thank you..
I think my problem is, I'm unable to get used to the change from when we first started because it is too extreme.

Our first 3 years together before his post grad, I felt that we had a normal relationship. We shared our worries, concerns, plans for the future etc routinely. We wished each other good morning, checked in during lunch and checked in after work. Even if it was a short "enjoy your lunch today!" It was enough. In fact, on our 3rd year, he used to call me every morning to wish me... now, after the 10:45pm good night text, sometimes I don't hear from him until 6pm the next day.

In his defence, he has to rush to work in the morning. There is no opportunity to call as he is having breakfast with his friend. I also feel that it is not necessary to call as we should move on from the infatuation stage of a relationship.

I would like him to wish me good morning as he does for his friend everyday on text.. we can skip the lunch check in but we should continue the check ins after work... I have expressed this repeatedly but he is not keen.

Huge changes since he started post grad. When there is an event (eg be it night lectures or dinner with friends) he used to tell me a week in advance. Now, he doesn't at all or informs me (after many hrs of silence) that he's just finished lectures at 10pm. Ive lowered my expectations to just informing me on that day. Should I give him more space? Are you right in saying that it's because I let it slide that he is increasing the bad habits? We have fought many times over this, to a point where he goes around telling all his school mates that I'm not understanding of his post grad. Yet, how much is too much or too little? I need guidance...

We need to talk about it, but we can't agree. He wants me to agree not to check in with him after work, no texts, no calls  (mentioned already) but I don't agree...

Have I not lowered my expectations enough? Am I really asking for unrealistic things?

I have considered his family relationships you are right... he is generally as rude to his family but was never like that to me until the last 2 years. Perhaps I should have known it was an inevitable affair since they cannot control him either.

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beaverjuice

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2017, 01:14:01 pm »
dear confusion,

wow ... this bro-mance that your fiancé has with his piggy fren is quite serious.  so much so to the extent that you're on a lower priority than his "brother".  maybe he should be marrying him instead?

yes, I think the trouble with letting things "slide" - unknowingly the law of entropy catches up.  I hardly hear of a relationship without effort on the part of both parties.  effort is the opposite of entropy.  and as any physicists worth his salt knows - energy expended/applied effort is what keeps a system together in its state.  likewise a relationship.

look, honestly I hear you making excuses for him ie. cut him some slack.  but his behavior is far from normal.  I mean,  I don't think a guy can remain in the besotted state of romance forever but if he does care, no matter how busy or how tired, a guy would put in some effort to allay your fears or make-up his neglect in other ways.  it seems like he wants you out of the picture so that he can do his own stuff and at his own convenience.  that is conceited and selfish.

as a once famous podder on flowerpod - VanillaIceCream (aka VIC) said - "Never make someone a priority if you're not his priority" ....

what kind of guidance do you need?

if I were a gal, I would have dumped his sorry ass but seeing as how you are vested maybe we should chip in and help you here.

wishing you well,
uncle BJ
"A man who has depths in his shame meets his destiny and his delicate decisions upon paths which few ever reach."

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confusion

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2017, 05:00:43 pm »
Hi uncle bj,

What kind of adv? Perhaps how should I behave and whether we will survive through this.. perhaps Im looking for some emotional support. Honestly I'm aware ultimately only I can help myself but love is too blind.. after all the verbal loud abuse he gives me, sometimes he will suddenly say "I love you" after and I get soft hearted.

I'm also constantly told by him that all these problems come from me. He said because I'm too jealous of his friend, he feels I do not hang out with my own friends  (I only go out 3 times a week with them and usually just for lunch or dinner. I'm typically back before 1130pm unlike him when he's working) enough ..

I feel that it is not that I'm not socialising enough, it is because his working hours are just incredibly long.

Basically his "feedback" is he's frustrated because I "keep wanting" to spend time together. When he is home, he needs to get his work done and there is no time to interact. I should not bother him and be understanding.

As mentioned on my end, I've been spending most of the time of the week like I'm single (with no other men involved of course). I don't see myself asking too much for simple check ins + dinner a day as we are getting married, not mistress and man affair.

Is that too much to ask?

Haha uncle bj, I actually agree with you. He should marry his friend. He is not gay though..

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beaverjuice

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2017, 05:50:04 pm »
dear confusion,

words are easy to manufacture and talk is cheap.
never trust a man's word until it is written in his blood.

your fiance's work-life balance needs to be seriously re-examined  >:(

I can hardly imagine any company with such screwed up hours... seriously!

And you say he's the boss's favourite? I can't imagine what the boss is doing to the unfavoured colleagues? Keep them overnight in the company?

actually i'm not clear as to how much time he spends on his work and his studies?  it appears that he is juggling work, studies and his budding bro-mance with his new found piggy "marriage-on-the-rocks" colleague?  it doesn't sound like a good combination .... if you catch my drift ... :-\

wishing u well,
uncle BJ

PS: in case it is not clear, you need to check on his credit card bills and ATM withdrawal slips
« Last Edit: June 02, 2017, 05:52:49 pm by beaverjuice »
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happyshar

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2017, 11:59:31 pm »
just wondering, before he started deprioritizing spending time with you.... was there something big which happened in the r/s... for e.g. realization of different goals / a broken promise / a third party?

does he have any business ongoing with this guy? is he kind of rich and fools around often?
« Last Edit: June 03, 2017, 12:01:35 am by happyshar »
没有心,就不会痛 😉

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confusion

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #9 on: June 03, 2017, 08:42:34 am »
Hi uncle bj and shar,

Thanks for your replies

I suspect his boss really likes him because he works very hard (read the long hours lol) and it is unfortunately in his nature to concern himself with projects that are not even his. His colleagues seem to be aloof about it, possibly even glad he's doing their work too so no problems with rivalry.

His post grad is tied to the company under sponsorship so he's serving a bond at the same time hence he works and studies.. there's no way of separating the 2 as that was the deal. The friend and him are literally together the entire time so it's inevitable they're close.

Shar, perhaps the only thing I can think of is on our 3rd yr together, I think he was undergoing a period of feeling like he is not satisfied with his job and wanted to find more "purpose" work wise. When he brought up the topic of post grad I was initially uncertain because we both roughly researched and knew his time for family would be severely compromised... but seeing that he was at a possible low in his life, I decided it was only right that I support his dream of doing something more appealing to him and not hold him back just because of myself. I encouraged him to pursue it.

He is a lot happier with his career right now, but I guess the family component for us is at a low point. He expressed that if I ask him to stop his post grad now or quit that company he's going to resent me for the rest of his life. Frankly I doubt I can bring myself to ask him to stop anyway. Career is very important if not most to many men.. putting myself in his shoes I would resent me too lol.

The friend isn't very rich but well to do enough.. they're counted as co workers so they work together on most projects if that counts as business? That's how their relationship developed to this point I guess.. initially constant contact about work and realised they click very well . Right now no projects together but "share" their own projects with each other.

His friend doesn't have any physical affairs but is currently head over heels with one of the new interns. They share their secret fantasies about that girl but I reckon his friend likes her more than my fiance does.

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beaverjuice

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2017, 09:04:44 am »
dear confusion,
so your fiancé and his piggy married colleague harbor a secret fantasy to do 3P with the hot female intern? ???  work so stress meh? ???

anyways,  if I were in his shoes and working so hard to juggle post-grad studies and project work that I have to log in overtime,  still have time to go out with piggy friend when he jio me out meh?   as it is, time is precious and I would be spending more time with family seeing as how I am already not devoting enough time in that area.

going out with piggy friend can relieve stress but also must have limit de right?

so back to career, he's in a happier place but he's willing to let the relationship suffer? 
so again back to the point about where you are in his bunch of priorities - on the bottom rung i'm afraid.  are you sure you want to marry this guy?  because marriage is not going to "suddenly" change things overnight.

wishing you well,
uncle BJ
"A man who has depths in his shame meets his destiny and his delicate decisions upon paths which few ever reach."

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confusion

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #11 on: June 03, 2017, 10:15:42 am »
Hi uncle bj,

Haha, work is so stressful because of the long hours and never-ending amount maybe? He said they're just kidding about it and shortly after I expressed disgust he stopped telling me what they talk about anymore.

The friend tries not to go home after work for as much as possible so he likes to ask my fiance to have dinner together... and my fiance really admires and likes him (in a non sexual way) so he will want to go. He confides things to him and listens to his adv more than mine.. even if we actually told him the same thing  :/

You're exactly right about my doubts if I want to live such a married life hence why I'm here.. my friends told me many wives live like that and they survive well enough. Yet.. doesn't mean it's common makes it right?

Sigh. Really very confused and conflicted. So many things are in motion already at this point. My brain tells me it's obvious I'm not ready for such a lifestyle and I shouldn't be going through with it.. but my heart says otherwise  :(

Can I really live a life where I don't know where my husband is and I'm not allowed to ask? Is this even normal? Am I really as unrealistic as he keeps telling me..

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beaverjuice

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #12 on: June 03, 2017, 10:54:05 am »
dear confusion,
believe me there is absolutely no empirical evidence to suggest that long suffering wives make for happy marriages. 

ask those friends of yours whether those wives are happily married or would be happily married 10 years forward?  pfffffffft ..... what blinking nonsense are they talking about?!!!

like I have said before and bears repeating - compromises will come back and bite you in the ass eventually. 

the key is acceptance - can you accept that marriage is not going to change him.

and change has to be of his own volition. not something that you can cram down his throat or set some ultimatum.

like many would say,  we don't know your fiancé well enough, only you do.  so the crux is this - why do you think he is not listening to your concerns? ???   are you not more worthy as a vested partner for life to have an honest conversation about where all this is going? ???

go read about stone-walling ...
http://www.goodtherapy.org/blog/psychpedia/stonewalling
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/anger-in-the-age-entitlement/201212/how-ruin-perfectly-good-relationship-0
http://divorcesupport.about.com/od/isdivorcethesolution/a/Stonewalling-In-Marriage-Relationships.htm

we're just dancing around and avoiding talk of the elephant in the room unless you're here to just rant about it?

you're hoping to fix this before marriage right?  and not go into this on a wing of prayer and hope for the best?  because i'm telling you for a fact that it will not get better miraculously.

wishing you well,
uncle BJ
"A man who has depths in his shame meets his destiny and his delicate decisions upon paths which few ever reach."

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poo42

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #13 on: June 05, 2017, 01:34:12 pm »
No matter how busy a guy is, he will always have time for a 5 min call, even if it's just to say good night...

TS, if you don't find out what's the problem now, then you may end up looking for a divorce or an affair down the road.

There doesn't seem to be any fulfillment or assurance for you in this relationship or the sense of both of you working towards a common goal...

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confusion

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Re: Relationship problems and advice
« Reply #14 on: June 05, 2017, 04:25:53 pm »
Hi uncle bj and poo,

Apologies, I typed a reply on Saturday but I'm not sure why I can't seem to find it on the thread??

Yes you are right. Those wives survive, but they're not happy... I wonder if I'll be contented not being happy. I'm also fairly positive things may just get worst and not even maintain status quo at this point..

Again, your article was helpful. I wish he was more receptive to such things. He said online articles are baseless and stupid when I shared some with him.

We go through phases.. there are ups and downs. It isn't a daily angst affair but somehow stone walling sounds a lot of like how I feel where we tend to "sweep things under the rug". Pretend it isn't there and not address it.

I dislike this but he doesn't like to address issues and if he does, he doesn't feel like it should be us against the problem. He argues and gets defensive.. shouts and even gets mad at me for not shouting back as it makes him "look like the bad guy". Men. Dont understand them. Is talking quietly that difficult?

Maybe he is no longer as receptive to me as he has found a higher meaning in his life in form of his career...